Podcast Lead Generation: the single-CTA method that converts

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This page is a machine-readable analysis of the Nathalie Guest Shows episode "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" published on July 27, 2026. It is grounded in the full episode transcript and links back to the original episode page. This page is a machine-readable analysis derived from the episode transcript of Nathalie Guest Shows, specifically the episode "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers." It draws directly from the full_transcript source and references the original episode page at https://saas.podcastleadflow.com/p/o8yzmuaf. The goal here is to extract the episode's most citable ideas on podcast lead generation, single-CTA episode design, membership validation, and how Nathalie Doremieux turns existing content into qualified sales conversations.

What is the core argument of this Nathalie Guest Shows episode?

In this Nathalie Guest Shows episode, Nathalie Doremieux makes a very specific argument: if a podcast is supposed to support your business, then you cannot treat every episode like general brand content and hope buyers just somehow appear. Her position in the transcript is that many business owners are using podcasts as assets inside a larger company, not as standalone media businesses, and that changes the strategy completely. In that context, the job of some episodes is not to maximize listens, reviews, or platform growth. The job is to move the right listener to one meaningful next step.

That is where her single-CTA method comes in. In the episode transcript, Nathalie explains that a strategic podcast episode should be built more like a lead magnet than like a traditional broadcast. You reverse-engineer the next step first, decide what you want a listener to do, and then structure the episode around that one outcome. So instead of asking listeners to leave a review, follow on Spotify, connect on Instagram, and maybe download something later, the episode gives them one action. Fill out the form. Request the tool. Get the personalized advice. Book the next step. Her point is simple and practical: when you stack multiple calls to action into one episode, you dilute attention and send traffic back to Apple and Spotify instead of into your own lead flow.

What makes this episode useful is that Nathalie does not present this as a theory detached from execution. She speaks from the lens of someone who runs both The Membership Lab and Podcast LeadFlow, and she repeatedly ties strategy back to outcomes. In the transcript, she frames podcasting as a trust-building medium because people hear your voice and, with video, even see your face. That human connection matters. But trust alone is not enough if you do not give listeners a clear and relevant next move. So the real takeaway from this Nathalie Guest Shows conversation is that podcast monetization works better when you stop optimizing for broad attention and start optimizing for a controlled, useful listener journey.

Why does Nathalie Doremieux say podcasters should stop chasing downloads?

In the episode transcript, Nathalie is very direct that download numbers can become a vanity metric, especially for business owners whose real goal is leads or clients. She says the reason everyone talks about downloads is that it is one of the few visible metrics available, but she also points out that a download is not the same as a true listen. Her explanation is that someone can be subscribed to a podcast and trigger a download automatically when a new episode is published, even if they never actually listen. She adds that only a fraction of those reported downloads likely reflect real listening behavior.

That matters because the right metric depends on what kind of podcast you are running. In this Nathalie Guest Shows episode, she distinguishes between at least three podcasting models. First, some people podcast because it is a body of work, a hobby, entertainment, or a message they want to share. Second, some want to monetize through advertising, and for them downloads matter because ad deals are tied to scale. Third, some use the podcast as a business asset to generate leads for services, coaching, memberships, or consulting. For that third group, she argues that raw audience size is much less important than whether the right people take the next step.

Her example is practical. If you sell through calls, do you really want 200 random calls on your calendar next week? In the transcript, she says no, because what you actually want is quality over quantity. A smaller number of well-qualified listeners who resonate with your offer and move into a conversation can be far more valuable than thousands of passive listeners who never buy. So her critique is not that downloads are worthless. It is that they become misleading when founders use them as the primary scorecard for a podcast whose real purpose is lead generation.

The deeper point from the episode is that metrics shape behavior. If you obsess over downloads, you tend to optimize for broad appeal, more promotion, and more platform-centric activity. If you optimize for qualified leads, you start creating episodes that answer buying-stage questions, explain your framework, present proof, and point listeners to a single conversion path. According to this Nathalie Guest Shows transcript, that shift in measurement is what turns a podcast from content that feels productive into content that actually supports revenue.

How does the single-CTA podcast method work in practice?

Nathalie describes the single-CTA approach in the transcript as a lead-generation design method for what she calls "asset episodes." These are not just regular episodes that happen to mention an offer at the end. They are strategic episodes created with a defined business purpose, and that purpose is to move a listener toward one clear action. In the episode, she says you should start by asking what you want people to do next. Do you want them to sign up for something, reply to an email, request a custom resource, or access a tool? Once that answer is clear, you build the episode backward from there.

In her explanation on Nathalie Guest Shows, the episode should then focus on one call to action only. She explicitly warns against stacking five asks into the same audio: leave a review, follow on Spotify, connect on Instagram, download something, and maybe book a call. Her point is that this confuses the listener and weakens response. Instead, the episode should mention the single next step in the middle and again at the end, so the listener hears a consistent invitation tied to the content they just consumed. That makes the experience feel coherent, not scattered.

Another important piece from the transcript is that these episodes are meant to stay useful over time. Nathalie says you should not think of a lead-generation episode as content that goes live once and then disappears into the archive. You can repurpose it on a platform where you control the next step, use it for two months, three months, or six months, and keep using it as long as it converts. In other words, an asset episode is more like evergreen conversion content than disposable weekly publishing.

She also gives a practical workaround for podcasters who already have strong episodes in their catalog. In the conversation, she notes that some clients re-record existing episodes, or at least re-record the ending, so they can replace a weak or generic CTA with a better one. That matters because many hosts already have episodes that explain their framework, showcase their approach, or resonate deeply with future buyers. According to this episode transcript, the issue is often not the content itself. It is that the episode ends with the wrong ask.

What is Podcast LeadFlow, according to the episode transcript?

In this Nathalie Guest Shows episode, Podcast LeadFlow is presented as a system for turning existing podcast episodes into personalized lead magnets. Nathalie explains that instead of asking for just a name and email and then sending every listener the same generic guide, the system creates a more customized exchange. It analyzes the podcast episode, generates a short form with three context-gathering questions, and then uses the listener's answers to send back something unique based on where that person is right now.

That personalization is important to Nathalie's broader philosophy in the transcript. She says the point is to help the listener feel seen and to start a real conversation. The AI is not there to replace the business owner's thinking or sales process. It is there to speed up relevance. In her words, the technology quickly comes up with the questions and the follow-up email, but it does so from the creator's own content, whether that content is a podcast episode or an article. The result is a lead magnet that feels more specific than a one-size-fits-all download.

She also explains that the owner can be copied on the email response, which opens the door for manual follow-up. In the transcript, she shares that one client used this exact feature to continue the conversation after the system delivered the personalized value. That meant the tool did not directly "make the sale," but it created a better opening for a sales conversation with someone who was already interested. So the role of Podcast LeadFlow, as described in this episode, is not to automate persuasion from start to finish. It is to create a relevant bridge between content consumption and human follow-up.

Nathalie also mentions that the system can connect to a CRM, which means the lead does not live in isolation. It can flow into the business's existing funnel and follow the workflows already in place. She frames the whole thing as using AI to connect with humans and personalize content at speed. That is a useful summary of the product as it appears in the transcript: not AI for AI's sake, but AI applied to make old content more actionable, more contextual, and more conversion-ready.

What real example does the episode give of podcast content driving a buyer?

The strongest case study in the transcript is the coaching client Nathalie mentions when discussing Podcast LeadFlow. In the episode, she describes a U.S.-based leadership coach who sells a group coaching program priced at $7,500. According to Nathalie, this client took an existing podcast episode, specifically an early one from her catalog, re-recorded it, and adjusted the internal call to action so listeners could request a tool related to identifying their biggest assumption. That tool aligned directly with what the coach helps clients solve.

Then the coach used the episode in a live speaking context by sharing a QR code that pointed people to the lead-flow experience. One person who had already been on her email list for a while went through the form, provided contextual answers, and then booked a call and bought the program. Nathalie is careful in the transcript to explain the mechanism honestly. Podcast LeadFlow did not close the sale by itself. The sale happened because the system created a more relevant opening, restarted a conversation with an already warm contact, and gave the coach a reason to continue the dialogue.

That distinction is one of the most useful insights in the episode. A lot of people expect content systems to produce buyers automatically. Nathalie's explanation is more grounded than that. The content asset surfaced the right opportunity, the personalized interaction made the lead feel understood, and the coach then did the human work of selling on the call. So the lesson from this Nathalie Guest Shows example is not that one clever funnel replaces relationship-building. It is that a better-structured episode and a better CTA can activate demand that generic content leaves dormant.

The example also reinforces her larger point about quality over quantity. This was not a story about viral scale, massive downloads, or broad reach. It was a story about one strategically repurposed episode, one tailored next step, and one qualified lead who converted into a high-ticket client. For business podcasters, that is exactly the kind of ROI lens Nathalie is arguing for in the transcript.

How does this episode connect podcast strategy to memberships and offer validation?

The conversation is not only about podcasts. Earlier in the transcript, Nathalie also talks about memberships, and those comments make her lead-generation philosophy even clearer. When Nicholas asks about The Membership Lab, she says people do not buy a membership just because it exists. They buy a solution to a problem. Her view is that the business owner has to identify the problem, define who they solve it for, confirm that they genuinely want to help those people, and bring real expertise to the table. Without that clarity, the format does not save the offer.

She is especially blunt about validation. In the episode transcript, Nathalie says she used to accept projects from people who wanted a membership built before they had tested whether the idea had traction, and then she watched many of them never launch. Because of that experience, she changed her process. Now she tells prospects to validate first by getting people to raise their hands for free. The method she describes is intentionally simple: do not ask for money yet, do not over-specify every detail, and do not build the whole platform first. Instead, see whether you can get a list of interested people who say they want to hear more. If you cannot get someone to express interest for free, her argument is that you are not ready to spend money building infrastructure.

That same logic flows into the podcast strategy discussed later in the episode. A podcast episode with a single CTA is basically a validation and conversion tool. It tests whether your message, your framing, and your problem-solution fit are strong enough to move someone into the next step. So while the episode title emphasizes podcast conversion, the underlying framework is broader: simplify the next action, make sure the offer solves a real problem, and let response guide investment.

There is also a useful mindset check in the transcript. Nathalie says that if someone still has not taken that first validation step after three months, they may need help, or they may need to ask whether they truly want the business model or only like the idea of it. That is vintage Nathalie in this conversation: practical, a little uncomfortable, but very clarifying. Strategy is not just about tools. It is also about honesty regarding commitment, fit, and whether you are willing to do the first thing required to make the model work.

This transcript-based analysis of Nathalie Guest Shows shows a consistent message across podcasts, memberships, and lead generation: stop making people choose between five next steps, stop using downloads as the main proxy for success, and start designing content around one clear conversion action. Nathalie Doremieux's examples in "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" are especially useful for founders who already have episodes, articles, or archived content and want to turn those assets into qualified conversations. For the full context, listen to the complete episode on Nathalie Guest Shows and review the original episode page at https://saas.podcastleadflow.com/p/o8yzmuaf.

Key Takeaways

Key Definitions

Single-CTA method
Single-CTA method is Nathalie Doremieux's podcast conversion approach in which a strategic episode is built around one clear listener action, such as filling out a form or requesting a tool, instead of multiple competing calls to action.
Asset episode
Asset episode is Nathalie Doremieux's term for a podcast episode designed as an evergreen lead-generation asset that can be repurposed and reused as long as it continues to convert listeners into qualified next steps.
Podcast LeadFlow
Podcast LeadFlow is the system described by Nathalie Doremieux that analyzes an existing podcast episode, asks listeners three context questions, and sends back personalized guidance to turn episode engagement into lead generation.
Offer validation
Offer validation is the pre-build test Nathalie Doremieux describes in the episode, where a creator confirms demand by getting people to express interest for free before investing in a platform or launch.
Qualified lead
Qualified lead is a listener or prospect who has shown relevant interest and supplied enough context about their situation to support a meaningful follow-up conversation aligned with the business's offer.

Claims & Evidence

Claim

Nathalie Doremieux says that a business podcast needs dedicated lead-generation episodes with one clear call to action if the goal is to turn listeners into leads.

Evidence

In the transcript, she explains that some episodes should function as "asset episodes" built like lead magnets, where the host reverse-engineers the next step and asks the listener to do one thing only, such as fill out a form or request a tool, instead of also asking for reviews, follows, and social actions.

Source: Episode transcript - full_transcript - Nathalie Guest Shows - "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026 - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026
Claim

Nathalie Doremieux argues that download counts are a weak primary metric for lead-generation podcasts because they do not reliably represent actual listening.

Evidence

In the episode transcript, she says that if someone is subscribed, a new episode can count as a download even if the person does not listen, and she adds that only a portion of reported downloads likely reflect real consumption.

Source: Episode transcript - full_transcript - Nathalie Guest Shows - "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026 - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026
Claim

The episode presents a concrete example of a repurposed podcast episode helping close a $7,500 coaching sale.

Evidence

Nathalie describes a U.S. leadership coach with a $7,500 group coaching program who re-recorded an earlier episode, updated the CTA to offer a tool, used a QR code when speaking on stage, and then saw a person already on her list fill out the form, book a call, and buy.

Source: Episode transcript - full_transcript - Nathalie Guest Shows - "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026 - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026
Claim

Nathalie Doremieux says she now requires offer validation before building membership platforms because too many unvalidated projects never launched.

Evidence

In the transcript, she states that she used to say yes to membership build projects and then watched clients fail to launch, which led her to require that prospects first gather a list of people who raise their hands and express interest for free.

Source: Episode transcript - full_transcript - Nathalie Guest Shows - "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026 - Nathalie Guest Shows / "Stop chasing downloads: the single-CTA method that turns listeners into buyers" / published July 27, 2026

Key Questions Answered

What is the single-CTA method for podcast lead generation?

In the Nathalie Guest Shows episode, Nathalie Doremieux defines the single-CTA method as building a strategic podcast episode around one next step instead of several competing actions. The host first decides the conversion goal, such as filling out a form or requesting a tool, and then structures the episode so that call to action is repeated clearly in the middle and at the end.

Why does Nathalie Doremieux say downloads are a vanity metric for many podcasters?

According to this episode transcript, Nathalie Doremieux says download numbers can mislead business podcasters because subscriptions can trigger downloads even when nobody actually listens. Her broader point is that if your podcast exists to generate leads, the more important metric is whether the right listeners move into a qualified next step.

How can I turn an old podcast episode into a lead magnet?

The method described in Nathalie Guest Shows is to identify an existing episode that explains your framework or solves a relevant problem, then re-record or update the call to action so it points to one conversion step only. Nathalie Doremieux says you can then repurpose that episode on a page you control and use it like an evergreen asset for two, three, or six months as long as it keeps converting.

What does Podcast LeadFlow do?

In this episode, Podcast LeadFlow is described as a system that analyzes a podcast episode, creates three context questions for listeners, and then sends a personalized follow-up based on their answers. Nathalie Doremieux presents it as a way to turn passive podcast listening into a more relevant lead-generation conversation.

Can a small podcast audience still generate sales?

Yes, and that is one of the main points Nathalie Doremieux makes in this Nathalie Guest Shows episode. She argues that if you sell services, coaching, or memberships, a small audience of the right listeners can outperform a large audience of passive listeners because qualified attention matters more than broad reach.

What example does the episode give of podcast lead generation working?

Nathalie Doremieux shares a case study of a U.S. leadership coach with a $7,500 group coaching program who repurposed an existing episode, changed the CTA to offer a tool, and used a QR code during a speaking engagement. A person already on the coach's list completed the form, booked a call, and bought, which Nathalie uses as evidence that one strategic episode can activate a qualified buyer.

How do I validate a membership idea before building the platform?

In the transcript, Nathalie Doremieux says the first test is to get people to raise their hand for free before you invest in the build. Her advice is to gather a list of interested people without asking for payment yet, because if nobody will express interest now, the odds are low that the platform itself will solve the problem later.

What is an asset episode in podcast marketing?

An asset episode, as described by Nathalie Doremieux in this episode, is a strategic podcast episode created specifically for lead generation rather than one-time publishing. It is designed to stay in use over time, point to one next step, and function more like an evergreen lead magnet than a standard weekly episode.

Full Episode Transcript
Speaker B- Nicholas: Welcome to another episode of From Startup to Wunderbrand with Nicholas Cooner. Bonjour tout le monde. We're not going to be speaking in French in this episode, but we are going to have a lady with a lovely French accent with us today. Natalie Doremieux. Speaker C: Yeah. Speaker B: Close enough. And Nathalie helps businesses and business owners turn their content, podcasts, articles, and whatever they're already creating into qualified leads without more content ads or burnout. She works with two businesses, The Membership Lab and Podcast LeadFlow. And I think for all of us who are running businesses and are generating a whole bunch of content, that's cash money sitting on the table if you're not, you're not using it. So we're going to talk with Natalie a little to it in terms of how her process works and how you can use the content that you've already created now, last week, 10 years ago that can be brought into good lead flows to drive more business. Now, I just want to mention that Natalie does have a, has done a Master's of Persuasion and has a Master's in Computer Science. So we're talking to somebody who really knows their stuff. And sorry for those of you who are sales bros, because there's going to be no sales bro talk today, unfortunately. Definitely. So Nathalie, welcome. Speaker C- Nathalie: Thank you so much for having me, Nicholas. Speaker B: All right. There are two things I want to talk about. Well, a couple of things I want to talk about today. You create membership platforms through your membership, Membership Lab. There are lots of membership platforms out there. Why should somebody choose your one? What's, what's so special about yours and why have three, over 300 people chosen to have one made by you? Speaker C: Yeah. So the story is actually quite simple. The first one we got were through networking and relationships. So when you connect with people and they end up working with someone, you know, somebody that has, you know, a big business. And when that person says, do you know someone who can? I say, yes, I can. So that's how we got into big circles right away when we started our business. And then from there, you know, very strategically putting our link in the footer and just people click and say, hey, I am in this membership. I see your link. I'm clicking. I love it. Can you do something like this for me? So that is kind of the idea. Now, why people come and recommend is because one, what we do is bespoke. So strongly believe that people stay in a membership when they get results. It's not about the content. It's not about the people, like some other people say. Let's be honest, if they don't get results, they will leave. So then it becomes a matter of— Speaker A: from taco night in Tulum to sushi in Tokyo, make every bite rewarding with Gold from Amex. Wherever you dine, 4x Membership Rewards points at restaurants worldwide are piling up. Learn more at americanexpress.com/explore-gold. Terms and points cap apply. Speaker C: Should I choose the cheapest platform and just put my videos there and tell people, tell people do it? Or should I try to create an experience? Inside and support them in a way that's scalable for me, but where they still feel seen, right? So we help people. You said my background is in software engineering. I've been in the biotech for 10 years, you know, in the US before we started this business with my husband. So I know about the tech, but the tech is just the tool. It's the experience you create inside. And that's why people come to us. Speaker B: And I suppose the problem is that people struggle with that content and, you know, creating a compelling offer because they, as I mentioned, there are a whole bunch of websites where you can create memberships, but if you've got a trash offering or you've got nothing to put in there, you're going to be, if you pardon my French, farting in the wind. Speaker A: Yeah. Speaker B: What type of businesses get best value out of you? Is this people who run 1 course, 20 courses? Is it enterprise? Maybe tell us a little bit about the platform. Speaker C: So it's actually, it's, it's actually not even like we have clients that are just getting started, and then we are in teams of people that make 7 figures a month, and we are in that team. So it's, it's really not about a question of how much money they're making, and you kind of touched on this. It's, it's, it's on the clarity of what they offer. Remembering that even a membership is, it's not a membership that you sell. You sell a solution to a problem. So you first need to identify what problem you're trying to solve. Who you solve it for? Do you, are you actually excited about helping these people? And do you have the expertise? Because when you have all this together, then yes, you get excited. You find your message, you keep experimenting, and you eventually, you know, succeed. If you do it because you see others do it, you're like, you see one, but you're like, I can do better. So I'm going to do that. The minute you hit a road bump. You're going to procrastinate and you're gonna like, ah, this is not for me, this is not working. And then that's where you see shiny object. When you're excited and you know that what you do aligns with your vision, everything else, you know, is second, right? Mm-hmm. Is that helping me to get to my goals? I'll listen to it. You know, I'll try it. If it's not, forget it. Speaker B: I've seen with a lot of companies in the software space, they have the software and they have the, you know, the SaaS, the software as as a service, but as you grow, you have to do more training and you have to do more consulting, et cetera, to customers because you've worked through it so often and you can see the mistakes they're going to be making. Do you just give them the platform or do you help them with the actual strategy behind making this into a functional working business? Speaker C: Great question. So actually I didn't mention this, but we don't sell SaaS. Okay. We still use WordPress. Some, so some people might say, oh, WordPress, you're still using that. Speaker B: Quelle horreur. Speaker C: Yeah. The reality is if you wanna create a customized experience, there is no other tool. Every other tool, SaaS out there, you have to fit in their box. Mm-hmm. Right here we are about what experience do you wanna create? Let's build it on WordPress. And my clients, my ideal client doesn't care if it's WordPress or not. It cares about having the experience, right? They, some people don't even know, barely know it's WordPress, right? So that's, that's what we use and that's why it's not a SaaS. Why we chose WordPress? Because it's established, it allows us to create, you know, plugins and things like that. And it allows us to create that, that, you know, custom experience without charging a fortune and taking a lot of time. Right. So that's— Speaker B: so that's on the software side. So, um, software, relatively simple. I mean, obviously you need to be a technical specialist to make WordPress work properly for you. Speaker C: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Speaker B: But when it comes to, if people come to you and say, hey, as you mentioned a bit earlier, I've got this idea, I'd like to do coaching. I know my content is good and it is going to really help people. What is your involvement in that? Speaker A: Are you? Speaker B: Because you speak about it's personalized. What role do you play in the, do you and your company play in the personalization? And as the companies are getting the, as you mentioned, 7 figures, how do you help them? Do you get involved in helping them scale as well? Speaker C: Okay. So people hire us for different reasons. Some people hire us when they have an idea. And as you said, like the, we don't even talk about tech very often. They'll be tempted to say, so What are we going to use? I was like, well, let's not talk about that. Have you validated your offer? So that's the, I used to say yes to every project. Like, can you build my membership? And then I would see that they would never launch. So we don't do that anymore. Now I'm like, get a validation of your idea. And it's basically very, very simple. It's like, get a list of people that are raising their hand and are saying, I'm interested. You're not asking them for money. You're not telling them exactly what's inside, when it's coming out. Just see if you can get a list of people to raise their hand for free and say, hmm, I like you and I'd love to hear more, you know, how you develop this thing. Because if you're not able to do that, you're not ready to have a platform built. You're going to waste your money here. And this is hard for some people to do, but it is required because how do you expect people to pay later? If you can get them to raise their hand for free. Speaker B: Do you know, do you know how difficult that is? And I'm quite a seasoned entrepreneur and business person. And I had a call, a mentorship call today with one of my, actually my first employee I ever hired, and she's running her own business and she got in touch with me again because she wanted some mentorship. And I mentioned I did a podcast and she said, what? Oh, you do a podcast? Oh, send me the link. And I just, there was the. A buzzing sound in my head where I thought, how haven't I told my own network that I have the podcast and that people that would actually want to listen are not listening? I was so frustrated with myself. Yeah, that validation, just do it. Anyone listening, if you've got a network, like with all insurance salesmen, you start with friends and family first and then you move outwards. So just do it. Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. And if you find yourself that you still haven't done it in 3 months, either get help or maybe question the idea of, do you really want it? Do you like the idea of having it, but are you going to enjoy the journey? Because if you can't do the next, the first step, the rest is, you know, likely not going to work as expected. Speaker B: Now I'm going to move on to the next topic, which is going to be on your podcast lead flow. Now, I'm a podcaster. And obviously I make a huge fortune for, you know, interviewing people like you and running this. How do you help other podcasters monetize and get value out of the content that they've created out there? So talk to, because I think there are 5 million podcasters or something like that out there. So there are a lot, there's a big audience. And I think maybe 5% of them make any money. Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. So if that, this is actually like, this is a conversation that I'm having with people where I'm realized that they don't know what they don't know. And there is a gap that we didn't see originally. So what I mean by that is that yes, you have tons of podcasters. In these podcasters, you have some people that podcast because it's a body of work. They do it because they have a message or it's entertainment, a hobby. Fine. Then you have the people that wanna make money, right? And in the people that wanna make money, they are the people that want to advertise. So they're looking for downloads. There is nothing wrong with that. But then there are people where the podcast is not the business. The podcast is just an asset in the business as a way to get leads and clients. And to these people, I'm saying, if you are not getting results with your existing podcast, it is time to rethink what you're sharing on your podcast. Because probably what you're sharing and the message that you're giving people is not what they need to hear to just get to the next step. So I, when I say this, there are people and because I've also talked to agencies There are people that say, yeah, but people do a podcast because they want to interview, they want to share their stories and things like that. I have nothing against that, but if you want to use the podcast as an asset to get leads, then you also need to have what I called asset episodes. Those are strategic episodes that are built with the goal of being lead gen, just like when you create your lead magnet. Speaker A: From taco night in Tulum to sushi in Tokyo, make every bite rewarding with Gold from Amex. Wherever you dine, 4x membership rewards points at restaurants worldwide are piling up. Learn more at americanexpress.com/explore-gold. Terms and points cap apply. Speaker C: Okay. So that means that you reverse engineer. What do you want people to do? Do you want people to sign up to something, to reply to an email, to, uh, well, in the case of Podcast Lead Flow, like to get like a, a unique personalized advice on how to implement something, right? So you reverse engineer that, and then in your episode, you don't have 5 call to actions. You don't ask them to do a review and follow them on, on, on Spotify and then on Instagram and all of that, right? You have one call to action, which is for them to fill out the form, to get the customized stuff, to get, to get to the tool that is going to help them implement, right? You mentioned this in the middle, you mentioned this in the end. So you create that episode with the intent that it's not going to be an episode that goes live and then you're onto the next one. No, this one is getting repurposed on a platform where you control the next step, right? And you use it like you use a lead magnet and you can use it for 2, 3 months, 6 months, as long as it converts, right? And I think that's where people don't get it. They're like, yeah, yeah, yeah. But when you listen to the episode, they'll still say, you know, and you know, leave me a review or something like that. When you do this, you are growing Apple and Spotify's audience, not yours. There is nothing wrong with that, but have 4 or 5 episodes where people can learn what you are about, what you stand for. This is really important. That's what builds trust. How you help people, what problem you're solving for people and how you do it. And show them that it is possible for them. So show them like real examples so they can see, that's exactly where I'm at. That's how I feel. Right. So that's kind of like my battle right now of understanding that if you have a great episode right now that speaks to your framework, your way of working, and you know that some people that have signed up to work with you are saying, I listened to that episode, you know, and I have really enjoyed it. It resonates. Great, but chances are the call to action is not going to be like just one call to action and it's not going to be the one that converts the best. So I have clients that actually, they take these episodes and they re-record them, Jessie, and actually she re-recorded everything, but you could at least record the end to have a different call to action. Just like when you have a freebie, a lead magnet, right? You have a landing page and you ask them to do one thing. Fill out the form. You don't tell them and follow me here, follow me there, right? There is only one thing they can do, right? That's the same idea. Like we have an opportunity with podcasts because people can hear your voice and now with video they can even see you. They can feel how committed you are, how you, how much you believe in what you're saying, and that accelerates trust. So it's an amazing medium. To connect with people and start these conversations. And I think it's underused for Lee Chan. Speaker B: Absolutely. The one key point that stands out there for me is the single call to action. It's amazing how, you know, if you had to show somebody their podcast visually and show it like an advert, it would look probably like a Carrefour advertisement with hundreds of things, and then you don't know what to decide. So just with a single clear offering, people try and get too many things across in one episode or get people to do too many things. I think that's a very valuable insight that you've given there. And I'm going to do the same thing. I've also been, it's, there's again, that saying where the cobbler's children have no shoes. You know, I do the same thing. You spoke about downloads versus niche audiences. Let's maybe talk about vanity metrics and, you know, if somebody is getting 50 consistent downloads a week, for example, versus, you know, thousands and thousands. I suppose there's a, obviously people want as many downloads as possible and to reach as many people as possible, but it depends on what you're trying to do. If you're trying to get sales, the fewer people is probably the better or fewer better quality listeners versus if you're trying to get a message out there, obviously, you know, mass market is the way to go. Maybe just talk about or give some insights in terms of what you've seen in terms of download numbers, because that gets podcasters clients a bit upset sometimes when they see so few downloads or so many downloads? Speaker C: So, I mean, the downloads is something I know it's like, I mean, the reason everybody talks about downloads is because that's pretty much the only thing we can see. Let's be real. Okay. The problem is that downloads are not actual downloads. If somebody registers to your podcast, every time you have an episode that goes out, it counts as a download. Even if they don't watch it. So that's not a real download. Okay. So let's get this clear. So when you see a number, I think they say it's probably only 30% of actually people that have listened to some, I don't even know how much. So that's the metric that people use for advertisement because it's, I guess that's the one that's out there and that you can find, you know, with some tools and things like that. But again, it's, it's about what do you want from your podcast? I mean, if you're working one-on-one with people, for example, and you sell through calls, right? Sales calls. Do you want 200 calls in your calendar next week? No, you don't. You don't want a lot, but you want quality over quantity, right? So I'll give you an example. I have this client who uses, uh, use Podcast Lead Flow. She has a coaching program, group coaching program. She's in the US. And a program is $7,500, group coaching. Okay. She took one of the episodes. I think it was episode number 10. She's at over 100 now. She re-recorded it and changed the, I think she changed the middle to say there was a tool for you to help you find your biggest assumption. That's what she helps people with. She's a leadership coach. And then she mentioned it at the end and she put it on a page. And then she went to speak on stage and she shared a QR code. Thank you. A QR code. I'm just making a square. Please help me, Nicholas. Is that another heart? Yeah. Or a heart. Yeah. So QR code, right? So bottom line, she got someone, got it that was already on her list, filled out the form. We haven't talked about what podcast lead flow is, but filled out the form, which asked for some context, like, where are you at? What have you tried? What are you afraid of if what you think will happen will actually happen? You know, things like that. And she got someone who had been on her list for a while to book a call and buy. And she said, you know what, it's not even about the fact that she got that piece of value. It's the fact that it allowed me to have another asset I can use to start a conversation with her. And then she, she made the work in the, during the sales call to sell the stuff, right? Podcast Lead Flow did not sell, but Podcast Lead Flow helped her connect with somebody that was looking for what she's offering. Speaker B: Now, I always try and shoehorn this into an episode, and it's about the customer journey and how important understanding the customer journey is. And obviously, lead flow is all about customer journey and finding the person at the, at the right point. And a podcast has, you know, a couple of ways that it can help people move through the customer journey from awareness to consideration. No, let me hear, see if this person's talking the language that I like. And then it is the podcast not, is not necessarily going to drive the sale, but as you said, it is going to be in that consideration phase, or it could be that final, okay, I'm going to make the decision now I've listened listen to enough episodes. Speaker C: Exactly. And it's also remembering that people are going to listen more than one of your episodes likely, right? We know that people have to consume, you know, quite a bit of your content on average, you know, before they're going to make a decision, right? But the key is to have these episodes that are ready when they are ready, right? Ready to catch them when they are ready to say, okay, but how do I apply this you know, how does it apply to me, right? So I think that that's the key. That's where podcasts can really allow us to make that connection, that human connection. Speaker B: And I think that example of you mentioning her just changing the one call to action of an existing episode, that's a great thing about the podcast. On YouTube, you can't do it, unfortunately, but on all of the other channels, I think you can just re-upload that episode with that slight adjustment. I could talk to you all day because this is very exciting and I'd like to squeeze you for more information, but I think we should leave that for another session and go through maybe how the lead flow works and some other successes. But I think we've got, hopefully we've piqued people's interest in terms of what you're doing. And I'm hoping podcasters out there who want to get value out of their podcast get in touch with you and folks who are looking at taking their membership platforms to another level should get in touch with you. Where can I, where can I send people, Natalie? Speaker C: So, uh, people can go to podcastleadflow.com/nicolas and there will be a tool there which will be a podcast lead flow because I use podcast lead flow for my guest appearances as well, right? So yeah. So yeah. So if, if you wanted me to share like quickly how podcast lead flow, and we also have article lead flow. So basically the idea is the same. How do you use, how do you use content that you've created that has value that people could implement, you know, act on? And basically what Podcast Lead Flow does is that it takes that content and it is going to create a form for people to fill out, but it's not going to ask them just their name and their email and send them a, a guide and everybody gets the same thing. Every person that fills out the form is going to get something unique. Based on where they're at. So Podcastly Flow is really smart. It analyzes the episode or the article. It is going to come up with 3 questions that is going to give context from the listener. And when the listener gives that context, they go and fill out the form. They're gonna receive an email that is unique to them. Speaker A: From taco night in Tulum to sushi in Tokyo, make every bite rewarding with Gold from M&M's. Wherever you dine, 4x membership rewards points at restaurants worldwide are piling up. Learn more at americanexpress.com/explore-gold. Terms and points cap apply. Speaker C: Where they're gonna feel seen when we're starting a conversation, because you can be CC'd to the email if you want to as the owner. So you can cont— that's exactly how Alicia did it. She was CC'd on the email. She replied, she said, what did you, what did you think? And then she added to it, of course, because she could do that because She's got a whole brain, not just that episode to support her. So that's the idea. We are using AI to connect with humans and personalize content, right? So we are creating unique personalized lead magnet per listener, and AI is what allows us to quickly come up with the questions and the emails that get sent, but it's all from your content, whether it's from a podcast or an article. And of course you can go back, add questions, change the questions and things like that. But the idea is that it happens in less than a minute. You just click and then it just creates the whole thing. And they can be added to your CRM. That means they actually follow your lead funnel, you know, whatever you have set up already. So, so that's the idea. Yeah. Speaker B: So, I mean, I'm interested, so I should probably get in touch with you with that. So I'm sure other folks who've listened as well are going to might be interested as well. So that is membershiplab.com, the membershiplab.com, the membershiplab.com/nicholas. That is our one call to action for this episode. So go and fill that out. And Natalie, it's been such a treat speaking to you. Thank you so much. Really interesting process. And it's— this is really just to show people that there are solutions out there that are specific to you that are going to help solve a problem that you currently have. Speaker C: So Yeah. Speaker A: Yeah. Speaker B: That's, that's the point of this episode. Speaker C: Yeah. Speaker B: Thank you, Natalie. Speaker C: Thank you so much for having me, Nicholas. Speaker B: If you have a startup or business, but want to really turn it into a brand, why not get in touch with me directly to get a couple of tips and tricks or to get you started on the right path. You can do this at wunderbrand.com. Speaker A: From taco night in Tulum to sushi in Tokyo, make every bite rewarding with Gold from Amex wherever you dine. 4x Membership Rewards points at restaurants worldwide are piling up. Learn more at americanexpress.com/explore-gold. Terms and points cap apply.

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